An Open Letter To All LGBT Students Of The Anoka-Hennepin School District

Well hell, nothing good comes out of Minnesota.

Prince?

Hennepin is the county for Minneapolis. Anoka-Hennepin serves the suburbs north of the city. I hope this helps.

Meanwhile, clipping to Anti-Discrimination, to Teachers, and to The Principal's Office.

In the photo of the two kids at the top of the article, isn't that a form of child abuse. Teaching your kids bigotry and hate towards others that are different. If they were teaching their kids to worship a devil, attack the disabled, gays, verbally or physically it would be a crime. Why haven't the social services come in and remove these kids for tier sick and ignorant parents that is breeding racism towards others which in America is a crime.

End all religions in America, and all the people will prosper and be better off with out it. The more you support church and religion, the less you will have in your pockets.

Teaching your kids to worship the devil in minn is a crime? Wow. Who knew?

Arieus

Isn't your anti-religious bigotry similer?

In the photo of the two kids at the top of the article, isn't that a form of child abuse.

hahahha you must not know that the photo is of (from the bottom of the page) ..wait for it......

A Gay-Straight Alliance school bus from Seattle Pride, 2008.

So how about you answer your own question....Is it child abuse Arieus ? Now that you know the truth behind the picture? ROTFLMAO

They must have been as you said ..."Teaching your kids bigotry and hate towards others that are different." Riding that bus told you all that ...well that is until you found out what the picture really was about..... So now I guess that line is wrong too !

End all religions in America,

Ah ..OK... so do we just scratch out part of the 1st Amendment or the whole thing?

If we are to do away with that pesky Right to exercise Religion then I vote for we take away your Right to Freedom of Speech! And to make sure you stay quiet the Freedom of the Press and the Right to Assembly ...

Ah hell why not throw out the rest of the Bill of Rights and Constitution with it...Right?

Jeeeezzzzzzzzzz

The more you support church and religion, the less you will have in your pockets.

My money and my pockets.... Please don't worry about whats in them and what I do with my money... OK !!!!!!

If I want to give it to the study of monkey breeding habits or a church ...Its my choice... Not yours ... You worry about your money!

Arieus

Isn't your anti-religious bigotry similer?

Nope. I don't use religion and an invisible man in the sky tactics to brainwash the people, and then pick their pockets clean of their monies like all religions do today.

I keep my business and private life to myself and not try and enforce it upon all others that disagree with these thieving charlatans.

I keep my business and private life to myself and not try and enforce it upon all others that disagree with these thieving charlatans.

Interesting you seem to be attempting to influence anyone that reads this seed, against RELIGION... you know your personal opinion... kind of pressed on others... You know some might call that a bit contrary to your statement!

And statements like "end all religions in America" sounds like your making you business EVERY ONES BUSINESS !

Teaching your kids to worship the devil in minn is a crime? Wow. Who knew?

Just curious, jrone...if I taught my child to hate and despise and bully Christians, would you be OK with that?

The criminal part of it aside, is there anything about that which you would deem an unacceptable way to raise a child?

Anoka-Hennepin ALSO covers parts of Hennepin county, hence the name. The thing about Anoka county is that forthe last 20 years or so, many of the most vicious and vile elements of the rightwing evangelical community have moved there, and are the CORE support for bachmann (Anoka is almost dead center in the district, and along with Wright county, another hotbed of religious reaction, account for about 65% of bachmann's total vote, and are the ONLY two counties out of six she's EVER won a 51% or better majority in).

Basically the worst elements of the republican party in Minnesota have concentrated in the few counties to the north of Minneapolis.

Well silvaria, if it's not against the law, knock yourself out. Teach your kids whatever you want. Bully Christians, bully homos, bully devil worshippers, that's your responsibility as parent.

While I don't believe it's criminal, it's just sad to teach a young mind to hate, and the best thing we can do is provide education against it. I'm glad few people have the glib attitude about it that you seem to have.

I know this seems like a great issue to hit Republicans over the head with but a simple search into the issue will enlighten you that this is infact not something new ... And has nothing to do with Michelle Bachmann as much as you want it to be ...

I almost find it revolting that so many want to use these kids as political pawns ...

As an example ....

A U.S. government study, titled Report of the Secretary's Task Force on Youth Suicide, published in 1989, found that LGBT youth are four times more likely to attempt suicide than other young people

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_among_LGBT_youth

1989 .... and check the statistics for today ...

They use the exact same statistics (from the seeder article)

Suicide rates among gay and lesbian kids are frighteningly high, with attempt rates four times that of their straight counterparts

The rate has not changed in 23 years so whats new???? Oh its an election year and LGBT is now a voting block !!!!

Is the treatment of these children wrong ....YOUR DAMN RIGHT IT IS!!!!

Is it wrong to make it a political issue and put these very children in the middle of a political battle ... HELL NO !

And you know what ? I am a 50 something year old man ... And I have one great damn big question.... Just what is a 13 year old girl know about being a homosexual and WHY has it been made something that she and her peers are even concerned with!

You know IMO who is to blame for the pain of these children? The damn adults that have made sexual preference a big damn deal to young CHILDREN !!!!

"Is the treatment of these children wrong ....YOUR DAMN RIGHT IT IS!!!!"

then why are you defending the bigots?

"Just what is a 13 year old girl know about being a homosexual and WHY has it been made something that she and her peers are even concerned with!"

because they're normal human beings who become sexually aware during puberty?

"You know IMO who is to blame for the pain of these children?"

it couldn't possibly be anti-gay harassment that reaches to the federal level of government.

Just what is a 13 year old girl know about being a homosexual

I was still playing with Barbie dolls at 13, but I sure as heck knew that I thought boys were cute. I imagine that lesbian 13-year old girls find themselves thinking girls are cute.

I hope that helps.

then why are you defending the bigots?

Please point out my defending them?

Stating that two wrongs do not make a right defends no one but the children... Thank you!

because they're normal human beings who become sexually aware during puberty?

Normal human beings ....(smiles) You ever been or raised a 13 year old girl or any child at all... ?

I have (raised) and her sexual orientation was not exactly something she was out marching in marching in parades about... Sorry for kids that age to be politically active on this issue is because adults have made it an issue...

it couldn't possibly be anti-gay harassment that reaches to the federal level of government.

This is not a new issue or even a more prevalent one... Gays in our society are more accepted and have more rights than ever before in our nations history ...

Its about politics and the tactic of divide and conquer ... And those on both sides of this issue should be ashamed of making it a problem for children that should be worrying about learning to read and write ...

I was still playing with Barbie dolls at 13, but I sure as heck knew that I thought boys were cute. I imagine that lesbian 13-year old girls find themselves thinking girls are cute.

Are they then confused? Is that what your saying? Then why make them pawns in a political battle and not instead just sit them down and talk to them and help them understand!

Sorry making 13 yr old little boys and girls the center of a political battle can not be the best way to handle it!

Basically the worst elements of the republican party in Minnesota have concentrated in the few counties to the north of Minneapolis.

Fear the Fridley. Fear it!

(if that listing is really so scary, then there's a problem....)

Are they then confused? Is that what your saying? Then why make them pawns in a political battle and not instead just sit them down and talk to them and help them understand!

No, they're not confused. They were born gay, and they have feelings for members of their own sex just as we heterosexuals had feelings for members of the opposite sex when we hit puberty.

Sorry making 13 yr old little boys and girls the center of a political battle can not be the best way to handle it!

Of course it isn't, and that goes for both sides.

You asked what a 13-year old girl knew about homosexuality. I'm guessing she knows as much about homosexuality as I knew about heterosexuality at that age, i.e., essentially nothing.

However, by virtue of being "different", she's certainly going to recognize pretty quickly that all her female friends think boys are cute, while she thinks girls are cute.

If you were in her position, wouldn't that make you curious as to why your feelings were different?

"Please point out my defending them?"

your attacks on the people criticizing them. They need to be criticized, assaults on gay rights are not ok.

"Normal human beings ....(smiles) You ever been or raised a 13 year old girl or any child at all... ?"

to a slight extent as an older brother. Hell I got a 7 year old sister already obsessed with boys.

"I have (raised) and her sexual orientation was not exactly something she was out marching in marching in parades about... Sorry for kids that age to be politically active on this issue is because adults have made it an issue..."

you're changing up your statements. You said what does a 13 year old know about being homosexual, nothing about pride parades.

"This is not a new issue or even a more prevalent one"

Yes, it's long overdue to be eliminated.

"Gays in our society are more accepted and have more rights than ever before in our nations history ..."

great, why stop the progress? Yay liberty. Let's get gay marriage in all the states.

"Its about politics and the tactic of divide and conquer ... And those on both sides of this issue should be ashamed of making it a problem for children that should be worrying about learning to read and write ..."

heaven forbid they also learn about life. Even though they'll find out about homosexuality with no one's assistance but their own hormonal changes, let's keep them in the dark about it. Wait for them to learn about it from their hateful peers. Although they might kill themselves over being so hated for something they have no control over.

Jim, I can say catagorically that you haven't got the slightest idea of what you are talking about if you think bachmann has nothing to do with this load of vile vicious hatred.

Bachmann has been one of the LEADING homophobic bigots in this state since her days in the state senate, when among other things she sponsered a load of anti-gay legislation (all defeated without comment) and reached the peak of paranioa when she actaully HID in the bushes in front of the state capital building to spy on a pro gay marriage demonstration, because she was afraid they were "out to get her", and of course the time she claimed a NUN was attempting to kidnap her and turn her gay (the police were called and ALMOST resulted in an arrest, against BACHMANN for making a false claim). She has been ACTIVELY promoting a VIOLENT homophobic agenda during her time as the rep for the 6th District (which I KNOW to be true, because I live in SAUK RAPIDS MN, in Benton county, which has been in her district). She REGULARLY ENCOURAGES total hatred of gays as part of her electioneering, in part to get the vote out in Anoka and Wright counties, the counties that KEEP her in office (she has ALWAYS lost Stearns, Sherburne and Benton counties, where I live, and has only carried her HOME county, Washington, ONCE - she survives because every election has been a three way race between her, a Democrat and an Independent party candidate).

So yes, bachmann is very much at the CENTER of the violent and vicious homophobic actions in Anoka county. And you can google Sauk Rapids, there's only one, and I live a couple of blocks from the Coborn's and Jimmy's Pour House if you don't think I know bachmann and her nasty smelly vicious record in office.

Ryoushi, her record of insanity MORE than speaks for itself. (my sympathy for being in her district though..)

My own deepest hope is that enough people have now seen how COMPLETELY off the deep end she truly is after the presidential run (and her proving her loyalty to Iowa rather than to the religious reich nuts who keep putting her in!)

ryoushi12

Jim, I can say catagorically that you haven't got the slightest idea of what you are talking about if you think bachmann has nothing to do with this load of vile vicious hatred.

Well then since you know everything and I know nothing don't bother to waste your time talking to me.... You see I have this personal thing of I really don't like for people to look down there noses at me and I really have a thing about those people that assume they KNOW EVERYTHING and everyone else is either to stupid to understand or must be filled with hate...

You seem to be a person with a lot of HATE for this one woman... I often see those that can see so much hate in others seem to be the same people that preach about the hate of others...

So how about you leave me out of any of your future quite hateful Posts ..OK !

Thank You ...But I really have no time for someone with so much anger...

If you can turn this ... From the Daily Beast ..not a Right wing Site! but not one of the crazies of the Left either!

during the question and answer session, the topic turned to gay marriage, Bachmann ended the meeting 20 minutes early and rushed to the bathroom. Hoping to speak to her, Arnold and another middle-aged woman, a former nun, followed her. As Bachmann washed her hands and Arnold looked on, the ex-nun tried to talk to her about theology. Suddenly, after less than a minute, Bachmann let out a shriek. "Help!" she screamed. "Help! I'm being held against my will!"

Arnold, who is just over 5 feet tall, was stunned, and hurried to open the door. Bachmann bolted out and fled, crying, to an SUV outside. Then she called the police, saying, according to the police report, that she was "absolutely terrified and has never been that terrorized before as she had no idea what those two women were going to do to her." The Washington County attorney, however, declined to press charges, writing in a memo, "It seems clear from the statements given by both women that they simply wanted to discuss certain issues further with Ms. Bachmann."

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/06/14/michele-bachmanns-unrivaled-extremism-gay-rights-to-religion.html

Two women followed her into the ladies room of all places ... Is there no place private?

And you turn it into this and pretend its true? That is a bit of an obsession one might say...

and of course the time she claimed a NUN was attempting to kidnap her and turn her gay (the police were called and ALMOST resulted in an arrest, against BACHMANN for making a false claim).

Sorry as I said you can leave me out of any of your future discussions...

Of course it isn't, and that goes for both sides.

That's why I said this.....

"Its about politics and the tactic of divide and conquer ... And those on both sides of this issue should be ashamed of making it a problem for children that should be worrying about learning to read and write ..."

Seems I did blame both sides, now didn't I ?

I imagine that lesbian 13-year old girls find themselves thinking girls are cute.

And since they know little about sex and such they might be just a little confused as to why they are different than their friends that think boys are cute... Was my point and Why I used the word Curious!

If you were in her position, wouldn't that make you curious as to why your feelings were different?

My point exactly...

I don't think that there is anything wrong with the child ...I think they need to be getting advise from their parents not a letter from a politically motivated organization AT SCHOOL !

Sorry its not the Public Schools responsibility to teach my or you 12 or 13 year old child about their sexual orientation... IMO !

It seems that some people want to make schools a place where they can deny some information yet provide what some might think inappropriate information in other areas...

Keep anything to do with religion out of schools Right? Yet teach young children about alternate life styles.. Correct?

Don't see how that works out ? Since its the religious that have the problem with the life style... You provide the information in a place that the alternative position is forbidden to be presented....

Quite convenient... Don't you think?

And you know what ? I am a 50 something year old man ... And I have one great damn big question.... Just what is a 13 year old girl know about being a homosexual and WHY has it been made something that she and her peers are even concerned with!

I think that by 13 most kids have an idea who they have an interest in. From there, it's simple and I'll explain it in a way anyone should be able to understand: a 13year old girl knows whether or not she likes other girls in the same way that you knew you, as a 13-year-old boy 40-some years ago knew you liked girls, and the ones who do like girls know about as much about "being homosexual" as you knew at 13 about being straight.

How difficult is that to understand, really?

"That's why I said this.....

"Its about politics and the tactic of divide and conquer ... And those on both sides of this issue should be ashamed of making it a problem for children that should be worrying about learning to read and write ..."

Seems I did blame both sides, now didn't I ?"

the only ones making a problem are those with a hatred for homosexuality.

"And since they know little about sex and such they might be just a little confused as to why they are different than their friends that think boys are cute... Was my point and Why I used the word Curious!"

so you have our side who want to teach them that it's perfectly normal, and when you grow up you can get married and have kids and be equal. Then you have the other side who want to teach them it's a sin, and that their desire to get married is an assault on marriage, nay, America.

Yea is so cut and dry .... NO ITS NOT...!!!! Some of those children have been brought up in Church's whether you like it or not and its confusing for them... You sometimes forget that their lives have not revolved around the things you think are important!

so you have our side who want to teach them that it's perfectly normal, and when you grow up you can get married and have kids and be equal. Then you have the other side who want to teach them it's a sin, and that their desire to get married is an assault on marriage, nay, America.

and you think its your responsibility to teach them ..Right?

Guess what ...its not! They are not Societies children or your children and for you or anyone else to take it upon themselves to decide what they should or should not be taught is more than out of line its so presumptuous, that some people should be ashamed of themselves...

You think its perfectly OK to teach them about sexual orientation because thats what you believe they should be taught...

Well flip the damn coin over... Do those with strong religious beliefs get to press their position onto your kids and teach them what they think is the right things?

Somehow if you think its good it is but if you think its wrong then it is ...

My god how some folks think the entire world revolves around them and what they believe ! And everyone else needs to see the world as they do!!!!

Jim44

And you know what ? I am a 50 something year old man ... And I have one great damn big question.... Just what is a 13 year old girl know about being a homosexual and WHY has it been made something that she and her peers are even concerned with!

Maybe when you were 13 you were attracted to that cute little girl sitting next to you and your penis became erect. Most kids at 13 can put 2 and 2 together and get 4, or an understanding that there is a sexual awakening happening. They may not fully appreciate what is happening, but they certainly know something is happening.

Maybe this 13 year old girl doesn't get all girly when a cute guy wanders by, but she gets a little wet when the same cute girl who sits next to you also sits next to her, and she is also putting 2 and 2 together getting 4, or an understanding that there is a sexual awakening happening, and in the girl's case, it may be frowned upon by a segment of our society that has failed to gain an intellectual maturity, even in late into adulthood.

Don't see how that works out ? Since its the religious that have the problem with the life style... You provide the information in a place that the alternative position is forbidden to be presented....

Quite convenient... Don't you think?

Actually Jim is the only one that is capable of seeing both sides of this issue from I have read.

Both sides of this issue are using their children for their political battles. Parents have the right to raise their children the way they see fit, no you don't get a say in how their children are being raised (although there are quite a few who are trying to take that right away from the religious) and Liberals are going out of there way to make sure to shut the religious people out of politics but doing everything in their power to shove politics down the throats of the religious.

Religious people have just as much right to send their child to a public school as you do. Just like your child gets to speak their mind about their opinions and beliefs so does any religious child get to.

"Some of those children have been brought up in Church's whether you like it or not"

and? Church's can easily be part of the problem when they teach hate for homosexuality.

"and you think its your responsibility to teach them ..Right?

Guess what ...its not! They are not Societies children or your children and for you or anyone else to take it upon themselves to decide what they should or should not be taught is more than out of line its so presumptuous, that some people should be ashamed of themselves..."

Wow, you get quite upset with me wanting to let gay kids know that they're normal and deserving of equal rights. Yeah, I think it's my responsibility, teacher's responsibility, society's responsibility. Because whether or not you like it, they are going to learn from society. And I'd rather it be acceptance instead of hate.

"Well flip the damn coin over... Do those with strong religious beliefs get to press their position onto your kids and teach them what they think is the right things?"

so long as it's not the hateful branch of religion, I love Christ's teachings.

"My god how some folks think the entire world revolves around them and what they believe ! And everyone else needs to see the world as they do!!!!"

do you disagree with my view that gay people are normal and deserving of equal rights?

seems to me that is what you are doing right now Jim. And the only hate being shown is yours towards people that don't completely swallow your line.

If your going to accuse me of something ....

And the only hate being shown is yours

Prove I have said anything hateful.... towards anyone... Prove it? Just because I disagree with someone ? Because I will not ...as you said ...

don't completely swallow your line.

But when its Your line ....you believe you have the right to say that about me...? And I have to "swallow your line... Not going to happen ....

and? Church's can easily be part of the problem when they teach hate for homosexuality.

True but we still at least for now do have FREEDOM of Religion... I nor you may agree with their teachings but that doesn't give us the right to stop it!

Wow, you get quite upset with me wanting to let gay kids know that they're normal and deserving of equal rights.

blazera ... we have exchanged idea's many many times ... I get upset when people feel that have some kind of right or obligation to teach other peoples childrens without their permission things that the parents may not want their children exposed to... Its their kids ! Not your or societies... I have said this repeatedly ..

Yeah, I think it's my responsibility, teacher's responsibility, society's responsibility.

Sorry we disagree... Unless when or if you have children you are ready to accept that others have this same right and responsibility to teach what they think is right to your children even if you disagree with it... You ready for you 7 yr old sister to be taught that evolution is just a theory and the creationism is in fact the truth...?

That what they may want to teach your sister is right, and you should not have an opinion to want them to stop, and let you teach her as you see fit!

so long as it's not the hateful branch of religion, I love Christ's teachings.

The only problem is you nor I don't get to choose.... Your not willing to give those parents the ability to choose what information about sexual orientation is presented to their children to to be FAIR you must also give up the right to control their message...

do you disagree with my view that gay people are normal and deserving of equal rights?

Nope ... And I have pointed that out in several ways in this seed ... Go back and read what I have actually said ... Not once have I spoken ill of gay people... Not once! Yet I have been accused by the Seeder of HATE !

I have but two issues with the Gay agenda....

1) the things we are talking about today ... What is and is not appropriate for organization and school employees to present to children without or against the wishes or permission of Parents...

2) Gay Marriage.... Do I believe that a Homosexual couple should have any and all legal rights and privileges that a heterosexual couple can be granted by the government ...YES !

Do I believe in Civil Unions to make such unions Legal and supported by the US legal system...YES !

Do I believe that Marriage is a union sanctioned by God of a Man and a Woman and should remain that way... YES !

Can we be honest, and not be PC for just a minute? If not ..Sue me !

I am old enough to have seen the transformation of our society toward the LGBT community. I remember when the movement claimed it was not interested in undermining the heterosexuals on the issue of marriage and all they want was to have the same legal rights as a married Hetero couple .... It was only about Civil Unions and all the Legal protections it would provide....

Many that are opposed to gay Marriage remember that and have lost TRUST in the LGBT movement and question its true agenda...

blazera ..lets be real ok ... its not a race issue or a political party issue ... Remember California and Prop 8 ?

I remember when the movement claimed it was not interested in undermining the heterosexuals on the issue of marriage and all they want was to have the same legal rights as a married Hetero couple

I remember that also. Now they refuse to fight for civil unions and instead fight for marriage saying civil unions are not equal to marriage. Next the will be fighting to force the church they want to get married in to allow them to marry there. They say they wouldn't but it will get down to it, because in people minds if someone is open for business they must gleefully serve all or no one. It's bull@!$%#, IMO, because churches should always reserve the right to function how they choose, that includes in thier buildings or any recreational facilites that they may own.

"True but we still at least for now do have FREEDOM of Religion... I nor you may agree with their teachings but that doesn't give us the right to stop it!"

whoa whoa, you've been obsessed with the pro-gay side not teaching. But bring up not teaching bigotry, and you go on the defensive.

"blazera ... we have exchanged idea's many many times ... I get upset when people feel that have some kind of right or obligation to teach other peoples childrens without their permission things that the parents may not want their children exposed to... Its their kids ! Not your or societies... I have said this repeatedly .."

and you continue the attack on teaching acceptance of homosexuality.

"Nope ... And I have pointed that out in several ways in this seed ... Go back and read what I have actually said ... Not once have I spoken ill of gay people... Not once! Yet I have been accused by the Seeder of HATE !"

then why are you against what I'm selling? Because all I am selling is acceptance and equal rights for gay people.

"Do I believe in Civil Unions to make such unions Legal and supported by the US legal system...YES !

Do I believe that Marriage is a union sanctioned by God of a Man and a Woman and should remain that way... YES !"

ignoring the suicide logic here, to kill the current institute of marriage to keep it away from gays, there is another problem. If you take marriage away from the state, then there's really nothing to keep it away from gays.

"I remember when the movement claimed it was not interested in undermining the heterosexuals on the issue of marriage and all they want was to have the same legal rights as a married Hetero couple .... It was only about Civil Unions and all the Legal protections it would provide...."

separate but equal is not equal. How are gays trying to undermine heterosexuals? How do they affect your straight marriage?

and you continue the attack on teaching acceptance of homosexuality.

You keep missing the point that you have no right teaching someone elses kid(s) anything regarding acceptance or non acceptance of something, I don't care if the subject is homosexuality or what religions are acceptable or not.

Thanks Sam I have tried all not to get that point across to no avail it seems that some folks believe their message is so important that Parental Rights have no place in our society...Well as long as its in relationship to an issue they support...

They would no more allow a Christian based organization teach their children about creation than allow them to be taught that bestiality is a good thing...

But if its about sexual orientation ... They have every right to teach what they want to what ever child they want ...

With No regard for what those childrens parents want...

Why they can't understand that I as the parent should be the ultimate decider on what my child is taught...Whether they like it or not... Its a funny thing about respect... Its is suppose to be a give and take proposition...

But it seems its not depending on the issue at hand...

If I don't want someone from a school or organization teaching my 12 or 13 yr old about alternative sexual orientation... I am a bad parent and should have no right to stop such teachings...

If they do not want their children taught of an alternative theory about the origin of humanity as in creationism as per the Bible... They are good parents and well within their rights to stop such an activity....

It appears this is all about the Progressive agenda.... if they support it its good and within the must be accomplished regardless of parental objections.. but... if they oppose it then parents know whats best But either way the government must step in and take over the parental role! And they wonder why they are getting such a fight on the issue...

Somewhere on some subject you just have to say NO MORE... And the Progressive movement has used this issue to change so many things some people are just tired of the giving and giving and then giving some more...

The example I used with gay marriage comes to mind ... First it was Civil unions that's all they wanted Civil Unions... After they got that ...The Goal Posts were moved ...

Gun Control another like issued get what you claim to want then Move the Goal Posts...

Parental Rights ... Keep moving the Goal Posts...

Well Parental Rights maybe the place thing finally stop ! They are our kids and No one and certainly not the government and special interest organizations have the right to tell me what my children must be taught about a subject they have no business being involved in!

Good luck Sam..

I am tired of being called names and my character questioned because I believe PARENTS are the Ultimate authority over their children... because I keep getting this....

and you continue the attack on teaching acceptance of homosexuality.

When its so clear that is not anywhere near what I have said.... I am against YOU telling ME how and when I must allow You to teach my child what YOU want them to know and what You think constitutes acceptance...

I refuse to give YOU my parental rights and you keep refusing to accept that is the issue...

This is not about gay children ...

Its about what and by whom children should be taught and

Who decides what and by whom... and when ! and

About why Progressives think they get to make those decisions for all parents...

blazera I am sure has the best of intentions, to do what is best for all the children... But he does not have the right to teach my child a subject that I do mot want him to ... No matter how well intended!

Just as I am sure he does not think I have a right to circumvent his parents rights as to what will be taught to his 7 year old sister....

blazera ...since you have no children as your parents or a friend that does...

Should the government or special interests be able to force a parent to make their children be taught something that the parent does not want their child to be subjected to?

Subjects

The benefits of war...

Gun owner Rights and why it is a good thing to own guns...

Why over 70 % of Americans are Christians and we need to bring those values back into the schools as they were pre 1960's

The draw backs of abortion and what is has done too the Black population of America...

Welfare and how it has destroyed the American family

The real history of America ... The forgotten Black slave Owners ....

Just to name a few.... You OK with Conservatives teaching those classes in America's schools without the parents of the Liberal parents having any say?

You really want it both ways but can't have it and expect that people will not object to the tactic of the left..

As I have said repeatedly ...This is not about gay children .... Its about POWER Political POWER...

Control the schools control the message ... control the message control the child! The child grows into the being that they have been shaped to become....

CONTROL THE PEOPLE! And its been going on for many many years.....And Progressive think their time has come.... They have shaped an entire generation to think they way they want...

We don't teach children to HOW TO THINK as we once did ...

We teach them WHAT TO THINK !!!!! now....

Isn't the Progressive movement Great /sarc

Control the schools control the message ... control the message control the child! The child grows into the being that they have been shaped to become....

CONTROL THE PEOPLE! And its been going on for many many years.....And Progressive think their time has come.... They have shaped an entire generation to think they way they want...

See what a good job the Liberals have done. Now their one and only argument for any disagreement to their thoughts is that a person is a bigot and filled with hate therefore they obviously can't be a good parent, therefore we have to strip them of their parental rights and take over. It's actually terrifying.

I have said this before on other threads and it applies here as well. When I was growing up I remember the discussion about Communism and that it would not threaten from the outside it would be too obvious and people would fight instead they would attack from the inside instilling the beliefs within people as they grew and eventually those kids would become adults with those beliefs instilled in them and then Communism would be able to take a foothold. From what I am seeing in our society they were right way back then.

Sammy your comment reminded me of a few things...

"We can't expect the American People to jump from Capitalism to Communism,
but we can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of Socialism,
until they awaken one day to find that they have Communism."

Nikita Khrushchev

Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves.
Ronald Reagan

"We can say right now that we want no further encroachment on these individual liberties and freedoms. And at the moment, the key issue is we do not want socialized medicine... If you don't, this program I promise you will pass just as surely as the sun will come up tomorrow. And behind it will come other federal programs that will invade every area of freedom as well have known it in this country, until one day, as Norman Thomas said, we will awake to find that we have socialism. If you don't do this and if I don't do it, one of these days you and I are going to spend our sunset years telling our children, and our children's children, what it once was like in America when men were free."

Ronald Reagan ...

Don

Why do you seem to want to require that the flip side of the coin be taught when I say teach children some of these things ...yet don't want that same standard used for these topics that the right do not want taught to their children...

Yet the basis for this seed is that if parents can't or won't do what we deem as Right then we will do it for them whether they like it or not! with no concern for teaching the conservative side... A bit one sided don't you think?

Why do you avoid discussing the major point of contention I have addressed Parental Rights?

70% say the are Christian but if you look at actual attendance figures they don't and trying to return to the '60's in a 21st century world is even a more ludicrous strawman than benefits of war.

Don I don't know if you are or are not a Christian... But as one , please let me assure you attendance in church is not a direct correlation to every Christians faith... return to VALUES that were part of American life and taught and lived in our school and children...Are ageless .. So ...Sorry I do not accept your argument that it can't be done! Right and wrong, responsibility for your actions and facing the consequences are still as relevant today as in 1776 .

Strawman again. So there were Black slave owners. Slavery is wrong. Although the Bible doesn't teach that.

Again I disagree.... Most people White or Black don't know our history Slavery is always a wedge issue used to divide Americans by color of skin... Why not demonstrate that slavery is an equal opportunity sin on Man Kind.... Care to take a guess what percentage of Americans even know the simple fact I stated?

It is to about gay kids....

I think I clearly stated why I disagree... Yet you avoided any mention of anything I said...

I think it was you Jim that pointed out the rate of suicide among gay kids,

You are correct, I also pointed out that the rate has not changed in over 20 years... suggesting that the problem has not gotten bigger, just more publicized and that as I also said the LGBT movement has gained more influence and power! Making it all about politics and Power ..,..

did anyone wonder why it's so high

I have seen a wide range of reasons... Can you explain why it has not changed in 20 + years if as you contend the situation is so much worst?

Trying to say "the larger you" are not homophobic while insisting that things for gays can be separate but equal,

excuse me saying there are differences in different groups of people and pretending that they are not different doesn't make it so...

Question ......To move this part of the issue to a conclusion...

First are members of the Alternative lifestyle community special in any way? Because if not, where do you draw the new line if you change the traditional definition of marriage which has historically been .... 1 Man and 1 Woman...

How do you justify that now marriage is 1 man and 1 woman .... and 1 Man and 1 Man .....and 1 Woman and 1 Woman...... And no other combination is acceptable!

What about others that would then feel they too have a right to be married?

2 Men and 1 Woman or 2 Women and 1 Man.... Please don't dismiss the argument..You know that once the door is open every possible combination would be open to interpretation of being a union that deserves the legal rights afforded a marriage... One the bounds of Tradition are removed , where do you and how do you make it end...

NAMBLA 1 Man and 1 Boy ? Polygamy - 1 Man and ? women... There will be people that will want to marry their pets for tax reasons there will be people that will invent things to marry just to drive a system without bounds... crazy or be the first to do it...

Effectively destroying marriage....WHY? To what ends? Its not about legal protections, Civil Unions took care of that? So to do it so people can use the word Married? We are prepared to IMO risk the destruction of the institution of Marriage?

Am I wrong ? If so how so!!!Then tell me why its worth the risk ?

Trying to say "the larger you" are not homophobic

Most heterosexual people could really give a crap less... Its made our business are there a group of fanatics of course but contrary to your statement the majority never think about it until or unless it is pushed in our faces and forced to act or react...

that you can teach your kids to be homophobic

more bull crap .... that is an excuse used by the left to use to claim they have to fix our kids... That has been the thrust of this entire seed has it not... Conservatives are screwing up their kids and we need to step in and fix it for them ! And its just not real in the real world... Again fanatics and fringe...

So, would you want me to classify and attribute all actions and words of the fringe far left to all Democrats, Liberals and Progressives and require you to defend against everything they may say or do?

and then send them to public school with those thoughts, I find that extremely sad.

Guess what there have been bullies and arseholes since biblical or Caveman days (which ever you prefer).. Being a jerk is not only found in people that have problems with homosexuality... But every walk of like, race sexual orientation,religion,sex, etc .. etc !!!

Kids are some of the meanest being on planet earth with or without parental involvement...

Most heterosexual people could really give a crap less... Its made our business

Exactly right!! Most of us don't give a rats ass, but it is thrown in our face every time one more person jumps up in the news and tells us they are gay. I don't give a @!$%#! Keep your personal life to yourself because if your throwing it in mine (or others faces) we have every right to judge that lifestyle if we want and not accept it. If people not accepting your life bothers you that much than keep your personal life, personal.

Kids are some of the meanest being on planet earth with or without parental involvement...

Kids have always picked on each other but now because some people kill themselves we say the attacks on gays are "out of control". Gays have the same protection and the same rights that every other person is afforded in this country. No one can marry the same gender (equal right), no health insurance together, guess what neither can most other couples that aren't married and actually many insurance companies are offering insurance to partners but still doesn't offer insurance to couples who aren't married. Gays are treated better today than ever before yet because many religions and most Christians refuse tho accept their behavior they feel the need to find some way to force them to accept them and if they can't get the adults to do it they will go to the schools and teach acceptance to the kids there where the religious folks aren't permitted to tred.

Don ....

Please explain how you get this ......

I find you even asking what my religions preferences are sad.

From this.......

Don I don't know if you are or are not a Christian... But as one , please let me assure you attendance in church is not a direct correlation to every Christians faith...

Just where was I "asking " Your religious preference? Because it sure as hell didn't happen with that Statement!!! To ask something of you would require a question...

I asked none in reference to you religion.... I made a statement professing that I did not know if you were or were not a Christian... I didn't ask if you were...

Its no wonder it is so difficult to carry on a conversation with you... You read into thing instead of READING THE WORDS WRITTEN... Then you say.....

To me that just says you want to step yourself above others which I get a lot from your comments.

"That just says you want to step yourself above others" .....

Really, What does that even mean? STEP YOURSELF ABOVE OTHERS

Is this something you do to to try and make people look bad ? A tactic to disarm people that you will not actually answer their questions anyway.... Or actually reply to even the parts of the persons post you find uncomfortable ...

Which I guess might cause you to say another incoherent statement like this......

If two same sex couple want to marry then they should be allowed to do so with all the encumbrance there upon under the Constitution they have every right to do so and I don't like the right trying to change the Constitution to fit their narrow minds.

Lets look at this jewel ...

If two same sex couple want to marry then they should be allowed to do so

two couples ? Well that 4 people...OK

they should be allowed to do so with all the encumbrance there upon under the Constitution

encumbrance ...really ?

something that encumbers : impediment, burden

WTF do you mean?

they should be allowed to do so with all the (impediment or burden) there upon under the Constitution they have every right to do so and I don't like the right trying to change the Constitution to fit their narrow minds.

Man I tried to figure out what the hell you are talking about but all I get is ..

4 people of the same sex you believe have a constitutional right to be able to marry with all the impediments and burdens they face under the constitution... And you don't like the right trying to change the constitution to ......to fit their agenda...

WoW .... Now 4 men or women have a right based your interpretation of the Constitution to get married..even if its hard .... .LOL !!!!

Don I am glad you clarified you position on that /sarc ...

But I really wish you would have commented on my QUESTION.... With something Coherent..

Question ......To move this part of the issue to a conclusion...

First are members of the Alternative lifestyle community special in any way? Because if not, where do you draw the new line if you change the traditional definition of marriage which has historically been .... 1 Man and 1 Woman...

How do you justify that now marriage is 1 man and 1 woman .... and 1 Man and 1 Man .....and 1 Woman and 1 Woman...... And no other combination is acceptable!

What about others that would then feel they too have a right to be married?

2 Men and 1 Woman or 2 Women and 1 Man.... Please don't dismiss the argument..You know that once the door is open every possible combination would be open to interpretation of being a union that deserves the legal rights afforded a marriage... One the bounds of Tradition are removed , where do you and how do you make it end...

NAMBLA 1 Man and 1 Boy ? Polygamy - 1 Man and ? women... There will be people that will want to marry their pets for tax reasons there will be people that will invent things to marry just to drive a system without bounds... crazy or be the first to do it...

Effectively destroying marriage....WHY? To what ends? Its not about legal protections, Civil Unions took care of that? So to do it so people can use the word Married? We are prepared to IMO risk the destruction of the institution of Marriage?

Why bother with something that has substance to it ...when you can first accuse someone of something they obviously didn't do and then make a jewel of a statement like the one you sent....

"You keep missing the point that you have no right teaching someone elses kid(s) anything regarding acceptance or non acceptance of something, I don't care if the subject is homosexuality or what religions are acceptable or not."

and why do you disagree with teaching acceptance?

"Well as long as its in relationship to an issue they support..."

don't you mean we support?

"But if its about sexual orientation ... They have every right to teach what they want to what ever child they want ...

With No regard for what those childrens parents want..."

If they want hatred taught, you're right I don't care what they want. You were just defending religion's right to teach, you're making a double standard here. Read the article again, because the issue isn't teaching acceptance of homosexuality, it's religious bigots trying to shove The Truth Project onto students, and legal advice for anti-gay harassment in general.

"Why they can't understand that I as the parent should be the ultimate decider on what my child is taught...Whether they like it or not... Its a funny thing about respect... Its is suppose to be a give and take proposition..."

there is no such right, or reality. Your kid is going to learn from other sources whether you want them to or not.

"The example I used with gay marriage comes to mind ... First it was Civil unions that's all they wanted Civil Unions... After they got that ...The Goal Posts were moved ..."

separate but equal isn't equal. And no, most states do not have civil unions, and civil unions are no where near equal to marriage even from a legal perspective. So many laws refer to marriage, not civil unions. I ask again, how does gay marriage hurt you?

"Keep your personal life to yourself because if your throwing it in mine (or others faces) we have every right to judge that lifestyle if we want and not accept it."

Lookie Jim, you're on the side of anti-gay bigots.

"What about others that would then feel they too have a right to be married?"

of course, break out the straw men. Because you can't come up with any excuse to not allow gay marriage. No one's talking about legalizing polygamy, and letting minors who can't enter any legal contract anyway or give legally binding consent marry is just an idiotic strawman.

Why can't gays get married? What does it hurt? It's been allowed in a few states, can you point to some of the destruction caused?

of course, break out the straw men

Oh stop the corny line about a strawman.... Just because you don't agree with the probability of something happening its not OK just to dismiss someone by saying some kind of magic work...

Just say Strawman ...then you can ignore anything you don't want to discuss...

No one's talking about legalizing polygamy,

Really? You know this how ? You might want to think that again...

Think Muslims... think multiple wives ... Its not just Mormons anymore...

blazera actually read what I said ...

Why can't gays get married? What does it hurt? It's been allowed in a few states, can you point to some of the destruction caused?

States and the Federal Government are two different things not to mention the complications of different laws in different States, Marriages legal and recognized in one State but not in another... A legal Nightmare!

And that's just for starters!

"Really? You know this how ? You might want to think that again..."

I meant here, now. People are talking about killing Obama and raping children if you include the whole world. Polygamy isn't the issue here, gay marriage isn't polygamy.

"States and the Federal Government are two different things not to mention the complications of different laws in different States, Marriages legal and recognized in one State but not in another... A legal Nightmare!"

so, we should make it federally legal? What's wrong with gay marriage?

What's wrong with gay marriage?

I'll try to answer but I also have questions ?

Its a word game... To many people in this nation marriage ..the word and the religious connections cause many people to have an issue with calling it marriage for gay couples. I don't personally know anyone that takes issue with 2 humans (can we at least keep it to humans) joining in union and living as married and having every last right that a traditional man/woman their problem is with calling it marriage...

To expect people to give up a tradition with such deep seated meaning is asking a lot... But to demand an entire society give up their their position that "marriage" can only equal a man/woman union in the eyes of God... Is not only unfair... but demanding more than many in our society are willing to give up...

Why can not this small group of people be understanding to the rest of our society that has held these beliefs for century's...Is the question from most rational people...

Be equal in every possible way just leave the name MARRIAGE... out of the issue... And you would see this problem disappear, for the majority of Americans even those with issues with our fellow LGBT citizens... they may have a problem personally being uncomfortable ...yes for all the wrong reasons, but they too are HUMANS...

So from my experience the major issue is the word Marriage!

So my turn ....

Is the word Marriage that important to the LGBT people?

Or

The rights and privileges bestowed on people that are considered married, are more important to their cause ?

blazera I believe the issue could be resolved easily with compromise the Liberal mantra...

Call the union anything but Marriage and get all the rights and privileges that go with the union of a man and woman.....

Problem solved....

"To expect people to give up a tradition with such deep seated meaning is asking a lot... But to demand an entire society give up their their position that "marriage" can only equal a man/woman union in the eyes of God... Is not only unfair... but demanding more than many in our society are willing to give up..."

marriage isn't a religious institution. I as an atheist can get married, and have never heard any outrage over it. People of other religions can get married. There are many churches who accept gays. And you just plain can't use religious argument for a legal matter, because of the separation of church and state.

I understand you've already addressed that problem by saying marriage should be separated from the state. But then as I said there's nothing keeping pro-gay churches from then marrying gay couples. There's also a problem with using an argument of tradition, being tradition doesn't validate anything. Slavery, misogyny, and blood sacrifices were also once tradition.

Gay marriage doesn't affect your heterosexual marriage in any way. It doesn't hurt anyone, gay marriage is occurring in many states with no problems. I have no problem with you practicing your belief of marriage being one man and one woman, but imposing that practice on everyone else is not okay.

"Call the union anything but Marriage and get all the rights and privileges that go with the union of a man and woman....."

for the third time, separate but equal is not equal. We learned this (or should have) from the civil rights movement and their "colored" fountains and "colored" schools. If you have to call it something else, then it's something else.

, but imposing that practice on everyone else is not okay.

There is the difference of mind set ...my friend... You see YOU want to change the current status Quo ...Correct... Yet make the claim that I (we) want to impose something...on you!!!!

No it is you the minority that wish to IMPOSE on the majority your will to change something that has been as it is since long before this country was founded...

Whats so had to understand that if you want to force change, it is you that wishes to impose your will on others...

Really its just that easy.... Society is fine, right now.... yet YOU WISH TO IMPOSE ON SOCIETY your desire and will...

I offered a logical compromise ...yet you did not even address it ... You instead choose to demand what you want..

You really want to know what is going to happen... Society as a whole will tire of tring to be reasonable with people that demand to have their way or no way ...

and the decision will be made... Because people are just about tired of being called racists Bigots and Homophobes because we do not agree with the world the way you see it....and want it to become...Because that's what YOU WANT!

Sorry .... those that wish to hold to a strict my way or else, may soon be in for a very rude awakening... Sometimes its better to get half the pie than go hungry ...

Our country is in for rough times because of the econpmy and people are going to be worried about many more important things and change movements such as this that have slowly been trying to FORCE change may well feel a public sentiment backlash...Because people are concerned about other things and are tired of the constant whining and poor poor pitiful me behavior, the look what they are doing to me and they won't let me have things my way... attitude !!!!

I want you to change the focal point of society ...because I want it that way and I will except nothing less...

Well good luck... I know people that were very pro gay marriage that are about tired of the constant drum beat .... This movement is losing support because just like in this seed you refuse to compromise ... And level claims of bigotry and homophobia on those that will stand up and just say that's unreasonable to demand an entire society change its feeling on a dime...

You did the exact same thing most everyone that takes your position does you demand to have your questions answered yet refuse to answer any... Don did the same thing....

for the third time, separate but equal is not equal

And I drop the B.S card ...

But its not its equal and you know it ... a name does not the result determine... As the saying goes a Rose by any other name is still a Rose...

Answer my questions or our conversation is over .... its unfair in any discussion to have a one sided debate...

I wish you and your cause good luck ....

"There is the difference of mind set ...my friend... You see YOU want to change the current status Quo ...Correct... Yet make the claim that I (we) want to impose something...on you!!!!"

gay marriage doesn't affect straight marriage at all. Nothing is being imposed on you, no one can make you accept it.

"Whats so had to understand that if you want to force change, it is you that wishes to impose your will on others..."

just because something is the norm doesn't mean it's not imposing on people. you're imposing a definition that needlessly excludes people, gays want inclusive. They won't be keeping you from doing anything, but you're damn well keeping them from doing something.

"Society is fine, right now"

if you're not gay. And my evidence for that is your own source from long ago showing a higher incidence of suicide among gay individuals. There is still a lot of harassment, violence, and feelings of inequality.

"I offered a logical compromise ...yet you did not even address it"

I addressed it at the end of my post.

"and the decision will be made... Because people are just about tired of being called racists Bigots and Homophobes because we do not agree with the world the way you see it....and want it to become...Because that's what YOU WANT!"

that's right, both sides want to get what they want. The difference is, our side wants acceptance, yours wants hate. I accept straight marriage, but you can't accept gay marriage, refuse to even allow it and ignore it. You bring up inane religious arguments, but your religions is supposed to promote acceptance, love your enemy, give everyone whatever they ask for, judge not lest ye be judged.

"I want you to change the focal point of society ...because I want it that way and I will except nothing less..."

there is no focal point, but countless movements going at the same time. It's a fallacy to claim the gay rights movement detracts from other important things. I'd also say it's wrong to say it's not important.

"But its not its equal and you know it ... a name does not the result determine... As the saying goes a Rose by any other name is still a Rose..."

so you agree with the separate but equal practices of the segregation era? I've already made a very clear case that it's not even separate but equal. Laws refer to marriage, not civil unions. And where those laws refer to marriage, couples in a civil union won't be entitled to the benefits or protections of those laws.

It also promotes just a general culture of separation, just like in segregation. Yeah, you're a couple in a civil union, but you're not as much of a couple as a real married couple. As I said, if you have to call it something different, it can't be the same thing. Because there has to be a reason you have to call it something different.

"Answer my questions or our conversation is over"

what questions?

For that matter, you haven't addressed my point that non-Christians can get married without controversy, that separating marriage from state will result in gay marriages, and still that gay marriage won't affect your marriage. At all. You and your wife are perfectly safe from their fabulous wiles.

Don and blazera

I truly wish the two of you the best on this cause... I have explained my feeling, given my opinions and attempted to explain what I believe other peoples positions on this subject to be...

We will clearly not solve this problem nor after so many posting even move one step closer together...

I think it best to just walk away...We will never agree on this issue...

you feel I am unreasonable and I think the same of you. Which as I have said IMO is where this issue has now reached in our nation consionce....

As Americans continue to lose their jobs across America ( my brother called me this morning he works (ed) for RJ Reynolds in NC, hundreds himself included were given their 2 week notice this morning) this issue will continue to become less and less front and center on Americas mind... As I suggested in one of my posts sometimes in search of perfect, the best possible is missed and I believe that the LGBT has missed an opportunity for the best possible in search of the perfect! But only the future will tell if I am right or wrong...

The 3 of us are wasting our time .... talking AT each other... because nothing is accomplished, if nothing else I have personally lost some of my sympathy and support for the cause of the LGBT movement...

The two of you have shown me more about the supporters of gay marriage, who they are and what are their objectives and how are the willing to find a resolution to this conflict...

From your comment I guess you just further validated your preconceived idea's of my side of the issue... So I believe I learned much more about you than you did about me...

So I'll walk away without taking a swipe at you two personally or your cause... I hope to just be civil and say we will have to agree to disagree... But not on the basic tenement that members of the LGBT are fellow citizens and are just as important to both our nation and to god... They are entitled to all the rights and privileges that any American is entitles to...

Our rights are inalienable given to man by our creator, man nor government has the power to give us our rights and they do not have the power to take those rights..

That's it ... no last OH YEA or swipe or dig... Please have a great day and Be see'in ya on the vine...

Good Luck and may you always have fair winds at your back and the sun on your face....

"So I'll walk away without taking a swipe at you two personally or your cause"

you kind of did

"if nothing else I have personally lost some of my sympathy and support for the cause of the LGBT movement...

The two of you have shown me more about the supporters of gay marriage, who they are and what are their objectives and how are the willing to find a resolution to this conflict...

From your comment I guess you just further validated your preconceived idea's of my side of the issue... So I believe I learned much more about you than you did about me..."

this is nothing but negative.

There are still outstanding rebuttals you're walking away from.

" Bigotry wrapped in religion is still Bigorty" and illegal.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeSSwKffj9o

Yeah, that must be it.

Never mind the fact that C4P's hatefully anti-liberal threads often end up on the front page despite a lack of votes and comments...yep, poor Christians and conservatives are being persecuted!

*Sighs*

Silvaria ....

Please tell me that you think Conservative articles are represented equally on the Front Page of the Vine..

Please make that claim! Tell me you can even pretend there is even one positive story about conservatives on the Front Page ...Just ONE !

Jim44, as I already stated, C4P's anti-liberal threads make the front page all the time. I sure as hell don't seek them out, lol...I click on them for amusement purposes when I see them on the front page.

Are there any right now? Nope. Is your world so myopic that because there aren't any right this moment, at 9:37 p.m. PDT, there never are? Gosh, I hope not.

As for equal representation, this is a liberally-slanted website. If you want a right-wing forum, I suggest freerepublic.com. There, they are free to openly advocate violence against liberals with no problems.

We're a bit more civilized over here. 8)

I am normal...for a liberal. 8D

Liberals are OK, its the fanatical Progressives I run into problems with ;)

Maybe you should stop driving on the sidewalk?

If I did I might miss a few !

Jim keep your snide remarks to yourself

People please stay on topic.

Get real Don .... Am I the only person on this seed? Your not liking me does not give you a special license to harass me just because your the Mod of the seed !

C of H

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You might want to refresh you memory !

so lbb which is the defect brown, blue, green, hazel, and violet eyes.

Blue is the result of recessive genes.

Don@6.1

Feel free to display and/or circulate my opinion. I think it is a reasonable middle ground. There's no homophobia there, no hatred. I expressed the opinion that it is wrong to hate someone for what they are born with.

Reddirt: Eye color, like skin color, is not a behavior.

jupiter: Yes, mental deficiency is a birth defect. One way to tell on Newsvine is a person who offers insult, rather than persuasive counter-argument.

In a similar way, people are born with a tendency to become...........

Reddirt: Eye color, like skin color, is not a behavior.

If you are claiming behaviours are innate those tendencies are controlled by genetics

Nope no bias in this seed ....

I say someone is normal and my comment is deleted ...

Juniper2 says...

Mental deficiency is also a birth defect. As long as you keep it on the downlow lbb, no one will think less of you for it.

An obvious comment intended to state ibb is mentally deficient .. and nothing is said or done!